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Q-talk 7 - Q-2 TIPS

VELLY INTELESTING DEPT. "I am building a Q-200 #2706...started in mid 1982 and would be complete except that I have undertaken the installation of a Turbo Wankle and all the complexities that entails." Larry Wade III, Beavercreek, OH (513) 429-5942.

From Steve Kuhns: Jess England (704) 692-9458 is developing a Subaru engine reduction system with a Uniroyal toothed belt, an automatic switching electronic ignition with a backup in a failure, a diaphragm carb that automatically leans at altitude and a muffled exhaust system with little added weight or power loss. This water-cooled Subaru is 168-175 lbs., has electronic ignition and hydraulic lifters, and has 460 lbs. of thrust (at 65 hp.). The engine package is currently being tested in Australia and they are proving reliable so far. Expected to be introduced at Sun 'N Fun in '88.

From Jack Soules: Len Ross is building a one-rotor Mazda for my Q-200. Abraham Water of N.Z. is building a 3-bladed electric adjustable prop for it. The airframe has been finished over a year now. Ross has put 10 hours on the Mazda turning a Grumman prop and it appears to be capable of over 100 hp. static. Compared to an 0-200 it is lighter, simpler, lower RPM, higher power, variable pitch, low vibration and easier to muffle. Almost too good to be true. (ED. NOTE: You said it...before I could. Somebody HAS to be the first successful pioneer, tho. Keep your bank balance up high enough and it could be you!)

From Phil Bryan

I got to the point of cutting the magneto box hole in the firewall (1/2" oversize at Mitch Strong's recommendation) and reviewing the plans for the mag box. I didn't like the way they try to carry engine loads across the cutout with stiffeners. It is difficult to fabricate and is not an efficient structure. It makes much more sense to transfer loads from the engine mounts to the fuselage as directly as possible. So I set out to design a stiffener system that works around the cutout (that is, I don't rely on the stiffness of the firewall) to transfer loads to the fuselage. This allows me to lay up a non-structural mag box that is thin-walled, light and has more room inside for the same outside dimensions.

I chose to run pieces of 3/4" x 3" pine on edge past each engine mount from one side of the fuselage to the other, forming a box around the mag box cut out as shown:

The stiffeners are bonded to the firewall with micro with corners rounded and fillets at the base joints then covered with 5 layers of BID lapping 2" onto the firewall and fuselage. I believe this gives me a stronger, stiffer firewall that is actually easier to make.

From Don Short, Stillwater, OK (405) 372-6116 or 377-1312

1. Definitely pull the heads on the 64 hp engines to have the stainless steel Collar Sleeve put in. Revmaster will do it. This will allow you to maintain 18 lb. torque on the head bolts, otherwise, you'll be adjusting valves just about every flight. I did this and my gaps are working 3-4 times better.

2. My POSA carb runs lean at the top static. Filing the needle didn't help so I called Rex Taylor (Hapi Engines) who advised me to go to 3/8" ID fuel line from header tank. I would like feedback on this before I tackle it.

3. Static Window Tint really helps. Cut in 6" strips, wash canopy very clean, wet, then squeegee on. Available from Don Evans Legal Window Tint, 523 W. 6th, Stillwater, OK 74074 or (405) 372-6929. $15 per 32" x 35" roll.

From Bernie Peters, UT

Several builders at Oshkosh asked me about my modified exhaust on the Revmaster. It is a very simple procedure. The exhaust exits on both sides. In doing this you eliminate the pipes on the right side of the engine from crossing in front of the oil cooler. You can use the flanges from the old exhaust and buy 1-1/4" OD pre-bent pipes of 45, 90 and 180 degrees. Saw, fit and tack weld until you get the shape you want. The 2 pipes on each side are clamped together, and I have recently added 45 degree bends to the exit ends of all four pipes. It looks better and seems quieter now.

From Don Coughlin

I have previously written about some of my innovations such as installing the wing thru the cockpit without removing the top of the fuselage. This requires removing only some tiny wedges from each side in addition to that material needed for the wing to penetrate. This insures positive mating of the wing with the FS 94 bulkhead and the seatback bulkhead, the latter being installed after the wing. Access to tape all the joints is excellent. I have a few more bright ideas:

1. The aft ends of my side NACA inlets are 6" forward of my armrest consoles. I ducted the inlets to the forward armrest, making a plenum of the armrest. Air outlets can now be plugged into any convenient place, top or side. The brake handle must be relocated or sealed. My master cylinder moved to the forward edge on the topside of the fuel tank close to the fuselage where I will operate it with a T-handle. The rudder cable runs through the left armrest in Nylaflow tubing.

2. I extended the pipe shaft of my right rudder pedal to the right 3.5" with an "L" up 4" and attached to the right rudder cable where it can go back through the center console without any bends. The foot pedal was left where it was.

3. I cut off my control stick 3-1/4" from the top at a 12-degree angle, reversed the top part and welded it back on. This gave me a 24 degree angle backward, making the stick vertical in mid position.

4. On my aileron reflexor I eliminated the gadget below the QCSA3 pipe shaft (there's no room for it in my case anyway). Instead I made the QCSAR 3 rectangular and installed side guides to make it go straight up and down and to keep it from moving fore and aft. The hole in which the cam operates was elongated horizontally about 3/32" so the cam won't bind. This also limits aileron travel to just what's wanted. Actually, the hole need not be circular at all, but can be rectangular. Keep everything snug to eliminate flutter.

5. I'm operating my reflexor about like the elevator trim using 2 cables and a drum, the latter being mounted on the same shaft with the elevator trim, but not attached to the shaft. I devised a locking scheme so the drum can be rotated and locked in any position. I have proportioned things such that I require only 90 degrees of movement of my operating handle to get full travel, 6 degrees up, 2 degrees down of the ailerons. It's very positive and slip proof.

Thayne Abbey

I read the Tri-Q hint from Danal Estes in Issue #1 just a little too late but still soon enough to save me some real problems later. Danal had installed the seatback bulkhead perpendicular to the fuselage level line instead of perpendicular to the fuselage bottom. When I read this I said "Oh Lord", went out to the garage and verified I had done the same thing not two weeks ago. This settled me into a depression slump for two more weeks while thinking of ways to best resolve the problem. Thanks to QT's forum and Danal's timely contribution I was in a better condition to repair the blunder than I might have been, as the aft matching bulkhead was not yet installed. In the unlikely possibility that there might be one more foul up out there, here is how I repaired mine. With drill, saw, and faithful Dremel, I removed all of the 1/4" plywood bulkhead except for about a 3/4" strip along the top where it was floxed to the seatback. The 1/8" sidepiece was left in place. A new bulkhead was fitted and floxed into place with its top moved forward by the remains of the old and its bottom positioned against the edge of the belly slot as the old one had been. The result is a bulkhead perpendicular to the fuselage bottom with a lot less work than anticipated.


N2832 turned into a reality Friday evening, April 10, 1987. It flew fairly nose heavy the first flight, but being a Tri-gear it wasn't a major problem. The first flight is definitely a thrill! Come to think of it, almost every flight since has been pretty doggone' fun!

For you guys that were raised on small Cessna's, like myself, you're in for a real treat! Stick forces, in roll, are light, I can roll with a half-inch worth of travel of my thumb.

Those long hours of epoxy up to the elbows have melted into the past, almost.


Props make a big difference.

Culver Prop: 60DX66P (Under Pitch for a Q200)

Temp 65 F, 900#

Climb @ SL 1600 FPM (Wow!) 2500 RPM, 100 MPH

Cruise @ 3000 FT 160 IAS 3000 RPM (not full thro.)

Sterba Prop: 62DX70P (To much pitch)

Temp 65 F, 900#

Climb @ SL 1200 FPM 2350 RPM 110 MPH

Cruise @ 3000 FT 165 IAS 2550 RPM (Full throttle)

I've taken the big $$ plunge and ordered a Warnke "almost constant speed prop". $425 worth of hard maple, 60DX68P. Sterba builds an efficient prop for $285 but it's not hardwood.

Conclusion: Go with a prop mfg. and size that's been proven on an airplane just like yours.

I've flown into 1800 ft paved narrow strips w/o wild brake stands or the like. Most grass strips are out. Tri-Q's like fairly smooth pavement. A tiny nosewheel, and no oleo strut are the main culprits.

Maintenance and problems:

I have 65 hours on my Tri-Q. I had the high oil temp. typical problem. It was cured by building the oil pan ram air shroud (templates in the book Firewall Forward), and opening the cowling exhaust area. The flat canard on most Tri-Qs block the escaping used cooling air. Also freshly overhauled engines run a little hotter at first.

I am having a little trouble getting Loran C to operate consistently. It works OK for nav. but the ground speed readout is a little erratic. All metal in the aircraft must be bonded together.

Tri-Qs fly nose heavy w/o wheel pants and fairings. Real ugly too. Tri-Q canards should be set at +1 degree positive..Talk to Scott Swing about it.

Phenolic pivot points will elongate eventually, I wish I had match drilled and reamed a doubler "donut" out of phenolic and epoxied it to the original, for twice the life.


When I bought my kit from another builder, he had assembled the fuselage and fuel fuller tube. The fuel cap had a 3/16 i.d. vent tube welded in it. 1/16 dia. is the MAX. per plans. Otherwise, too much of your ram air pressure is lost, and you might not have enough head pressure in a climb or to run your header tank down. I found out the hard way, as I was flying over my house with my waving wife in the front yard. Her waving lost some of its zeal as the ole 0-200 started to sputter. Not to mention the look on the pilots face! Luckily I made it back to the airport, the engine actually quit once but started again on its own. I think a fuel pump, as back up would be wise. On a related note, those of you flying your Qs, ever get a gassy smell just after you've topped off your tank? How about fuel in your baggage compartment? I did but only when I filled up with auto fuel. Figure that one out! I finally did. Fuel was sloshing/blowing out of the fuel cap vent, blowing back along the outside of the fuselage going in the split line, running down the attachment fingers, and into the baggage compartment. And it only did it with auto fuel because I never "topped it off" with avgas cause it's too expensive!

Over the summer I've added an Escort II 3" digital navcom, King Loran, fairings and wheelpants. Also nav and strobe lights. All in all it's been a very QUICK summer!!

Anyone interested in talking Quickies, don't hesitate to give me a call. (716) 344-2695

I am building a Tri-Q-C-85 with moderate wing extensions (31 inches total). I would like to throw out some ideas/observations.

1) Brass bonds poorly to Safe-T-Poxy (i.e. gas tank fittings).

2) If elevators are made first, they can be used as forms when laminating the slot in the slot form cores. Cover the wide part of elevator longitudinally with gray tape then jig into the slot's U before lamination cures. This will give an even gap; otherwise, you will spend much time and frustration making gap even.

3) If main wing is extended and you desire to test it, make sure you laminate it into the fuselage first. I tested mine out of the fuselage and it broke at BL 0 due to foam crushing. Mark Waddelow also broke his main wing with an out-of-fuselage cradle. Leave the fuselage area over the main wing off for testing and make a form to set upside down wing/fuselage combination onto.

4) I fabricated a removable panel on the rear of my mag box to adjust magneto timing and for access to oil screen. I do not know what FAA inspectors will say.

5) Three to four inch PVC pipe makes a good tunnel for elevator controls to pass through main tank on flat LS 1 canard Tri-Qs.

6) For Tri Q builders, changes to the rudder "horns" extending them out for less sensitivity can be made simply by switching the aileron control counterpart (it passes through FS95 bulkhead), which Plan Changes say is too wide, with the existing too narrow rudder horn and using rudder horn at rear of aileron torque tube.

7) I used a stainless steel food strainer for my main tank gas screen. A PVC reducer was bonded into the header tank with the 3/8" female pipe thread then available for a brass finger screen.

8) If anyone needs an improved layup schedule for the extended main wing, I have the BL figures, which Mark Waddelow computed for a 240" wing. Mine tested OK at 20% over a Gene Sheehan - provided 4.4 g test loading. Call at (609) 654-9187 (home) or (609) 234-7600 (work), if you would like to exchange ideas or live in the area.

9) I hope to be flying this summer!

John Groff #2627 South - New Jersey

Larry Koutz

I am going to a vo-tec school part time, which gives me access to a machine shop, welding lab and an electronics lab. I usually have time during the quarter to build small parts for my Q-200. I would recommend technical schools for builders because the tuition is usually inexpensive and there is access to many tools and machines that the normal builder doesn't have. I have built a bracket to mount a small 60-amp alternator to the 0-200 engine. This unit is cheap ($60 for the alternator), the same weight as the 20 amp generator and about the same size. My unit is unproven, although Scott Swing has this on his airplane. I have also devised a way to get my reflexer to act as a spoiler. I have an actuator that will move the aileron torque tube down about an inch, which moves the ailerons up about 35 degrees and will kill lift when on the ground. I have individual brake handles, but I need to find some valving arrangement to get individual braking or to have equal pressure go to both wheels. I built a locking/safety latch into the upper back of the fuselage much like the key lock shown in the Sept/Oct issue. This mechanism built from a deadbolt will lock the canopy closed, lock it partially open (2.5"), allow the canopy to be partially open while taxiing on the ground and prevent the canopy from flying open in flight if the regular locks fail.

You can see I have been busy ---- but I don't know how effective any of my changes will be because they are all untried! It would be great to have some experience!

Well, I'll keep plodding along and hope to have this dream machine ready by Fun-n-Sun.

Richard L. Kautz

I want to thank all the Quickie and Q2/200 pilots that showed up at OSH with their machines. It was a real inspiration.

Right now I am working on my canopy using the Forward Hinging Canopy Kit that Quickie sold. If anyone would like a copy of the plans, I would be happy to make a set, IF, you send a SASE. Anyway, I was kind of surprised to see that no one had the stock kit; (forget what it cost) it seems to do the trick very nicely and it certainly is well built. I found some excellent "P" type seals made by a company in Sweden and distributed in this country by Scandy Corp., 585H Tollgate Rd., Elgin, IL 60120. The catalog no. is 44-58364 and it retails for about $3.50 for a 17 foot roll. It's really nice stuff for sealing all around the canopy and I think it will really keep the slipstream noise down. Adhesive is great --- stuff really sticks to fiberglass! Regarding canopy seals, Tony Bingelis just wrote a great column in Sport Aviation on the subject.

Someone at Osh gave me a great idea for an extension for the fuel shut off. (I don't remember who, but thanks!) Basically, I took the stock valve, removed the handle, slipped a piece of 4140 steel tubing over the valve shaft, inserted a piece of 1/4" steel rod into the other end of the steel tubing and held it together with a pair of cotter pins. I machined the end of the rod so the valve handle would fit and presto! The cotter pins (actually I used cowling pins) make the shaft easy to disconnect if I have to pull the instrument panel out.

I used the liquid firewall on my plane and it seems to be OK. I sprayed it on using about 35 P.S.I. It spatters really easy though and once you make a mistake it's not easy to smooth out. I won't talk about how long it takes to dry --- I finally set up a heat gun about 2 feet away and let it run for a good ten hours.

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